Dear Pandu and Corey – Have you people gone completely insane?
Sunday morning. I woke up and checked out PlanetISKCON only to be greeted with the amazingly nasty description of Hugh Heffner’s sex life (Ugh!) as posted by Pandu dasa via Bhakta Corey’s blog of ever-changing and wildly irrational rantings (here and here).
The main point seems to be that if you change the definition of homosexuality to mean “promiscuous sex” then a whole lot more people are gay than before.
Since this argument really makes no sense at all, I’ll not refute it and just allow it to defeat itself.
The post then goes on to bring “Illuminati bankers” into it. They used Playboy Magazine to destroy the institution of marriage. See, Illuminati bankers “own the major cartels and control the media through advertising.” I think I sort of dozed off there because blaming “Illuminati bankers” for stuff is almost as logical as changing the definition of homosexuality to prove your point.
And what is the point? I think it’s that all porn is gay porn. To prove the point, they use their definition of “gay.” It’s convenient and fun!
By the way, all cookies are chocolate chip cookies because I’ve just changed the definition of “walnut” to mean “tiny bits of chocolate.” Same goes for snickerdoodles. The illuminati bakers are controlling the Keebler elves and the lunatic is on the grass.
Pandu, seriously now. You really believe this stuff? That illuminati bankers are destroying marriage via Hugh Heffner? As far as conspiracy theories go, that’s quite a stretch.
And you do realize that you can’t actually change the definition of words to prove a point, right? That’s typically considered bad logic and you pretty much automatically lose your argument. Bring the Illuminati into it and you not only lose, but it’s pretty much time to be fitted with a straight jacket.
Related posts:
08/30/2009 at 1:46 pm
Dude, I read that. It was revolting on a few levels. The Illuminati? Oh my! That’s like insta-fail. It’s like four rungs down from blaming Jews. This isn’t a Dan Brown novel, yo.
You mention that and all you’re left with is foot-bullets and an audience that’s run away either laughing or they have backed away slowly, shaking their heads.
By the way, I haz new blog.
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eric Reply:
August 30th, 2009 at 4:41 pm
Yeah. Very fail. Pandu says that he doesn’t buy into the Illuminati stuff, but then why post it at all? He says that it wasn’t a very big point of the article, but it sort of was.
Everybody is going insane.
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pants Reply:
August 30th, 2009 at 7:18 pm
To me it was a big point. It was the point where I laughed. A hearty chuckle after being repulsed is a good thing.
For starter : I did not need to hear about Hugh Hefner’s sex life. Talk about smut peddling.
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eric Reply:
August 30th, 2009 at 8:16 pm
So true. I mean, I was repulsed, then in disagreement and then i giggled at the mention of the Illuminati.
What a maroon!
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08/30/2009 at 10:18 pm
is this some elaborate joke? like the punchline is gonna be about how all porn is now gay porn, and men everywhere are all, ‘where my vaginas be at?” and then there is a laugh track?
illuminati bankers is a joke, surely? it’s funny.
changing the definition of snickerdoodles is funny too.
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eric Reply:
August 30th, 2009 at 11:01 pm
I with this and the last post of mine were both jokes. Sadly, they’re not. But my religion, as it turns out, is turning into one big giant joke right before my eyes.
Thankfully there are many devotees who think stuff like this is wickity wack.
I’m going to blame pretty much everything on Illuminati bankers. I’m also making tin foil hats for all of us. I’ll charge five dollars. And an extra dollar for the aliens in my head.
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08/31/2009 at 12:52 am
LOL +1
Watch Corey continue to move toward the ultra-right “Christian” anti-cult attractor point that he currently orbiting.
By the way, that once you accept contraception and sex for pleasure only whether that sex is with a same-sex or opposite sex partner is a smaller jump, is arguably a fact. So I agree that there is a kernel for discussion in that article, but it’s decontextualized and hijacked for another agenda there – hardly discussed intelligently…
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eric Reply:
August 31st, 2009 at 7:51 am
I agree, there’s really no difference in that way, but it just doesn’t make all porn gay porn. We have words for a reason. They describe stuff. When you start using some words to describe other things, it just makes you seem silly.
And something about the Illuminati.
Pandu says that doesn’t believe in the Illuminati stuff, and I pretty well believe him. But then why post it? It’s like posting a really good lasagna recipe only to find that it was written by Pol Pot and not really lasagna at all, but eggplant parmesan that’s now being called lasagna.
Maybe Corey is a DaDaist? If so, well done!
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08/31/2009 at 7:01 am
Actually I skipped that article… TLDR
and your vintage stuff *YAY*.
I visit PlanetISKCON only for the fun stuff like pics, kirtans, Sitapati Prabhu
But you are right, after your post I went back and read the article. I didn’t understand what it had to do with Krsna consciousness and who cares about Hugh Heffner? Even so, going into detail there is no logic with the punchline, or the article for that matter, that all porn is gay porn. Wait.. what?
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eric Reply:
August 31st, 2009 at 7:53 am
The vintage stuff will be back soon. This one album is taking forever. I have eight more hours of work to do on it and am mentally beaten into a pulp. Maybe I’ll set it aside and do another one that is better produced and not a crackly. Whew!
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08/31/2009 at 7:55 am
oh and this…
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pants Reply:
August 31st, 2009 at 8:11 am
I’ve always wanted to say to someone “Your hentai is soooo gay”. Now I can.
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08/31/2009 at 10:32 am
Eric, perhaps your liberal conditioning acted as a buffer against understanding the simple logic of his argument?
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eric Reply:
August 31st, 2009 at 10:37 am
You know, that must be right. I’m so liberal that I can’t see the truth that straight is gay and Illuminati bankers are using Hugh Heffner to destroy marriage.
Makes perfect sense now.
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08/31/2009 at 11:37 am
Eric,
I quit reading your blog a few months ago when you were openly attacking Srila Prabhupada, so I don’t intend to give you much of my time now. I just got word thay you personally attacked me here.
As I told you, I don’t get into conspiracy theories, but Srila Prabhupada did say that the women’s so-called liberation movement was a plot by men to make free prostitutes. Who might those men be? Naturally one would expect those in control of the media, government, etc. Whether that means Illuminati or someone else, I don’t know, but I didn’t feel it right to chop up the article because if it.
I saw the article raising awareness of the fact that pornography promotes homosexuality, a concept that I first heard in Srila Prabhupada’s teachings. But then I can’t count on you to accept something just because Srila Prabhupada said it.
Prabhupada: That is not enjoyment. Just like sex indulgence. If you
indulge in more than necessary, then you will be impotent. Nature will
stop. You know impotency? That will be there. Impotency. This homosex
is also another sign of impotency. They do not feel sex impulse to
woman. They feel sex impulse in man. That means he is impotent. It is
impotency. So things are coming so rubbish now. This is the time for
preaching our program, standard. Then?
Nitai: “For example, marriage, or the combination of a man with a
woman, is necessary for progeny, but it is not meant for sense
enjoyment.”
Prabhupada: Now this progeny is bother. It is sense enjoyment,
homosex. Progeny, they don’t want. They’re not interested. Only sense
gratification. This is another sign of impotency. When after enjoying
so many women, they become impotent, then they artificially create
another sex impulse in homosex. This is the psychology. So people are
degraded so much.
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Arrival — Chicago, July 3, 1975
Brahmananda: Actually you’re supposed to see other women as mother.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Brahmananda: But not one’s own wife.
Prabhupada: No. Para-daresu. Matravat para-daresu. That is the
injunction of the sas… Other’s wife. Not that “Oh, my wife is also
my mother.” Just see. This lunacy is going on, and this lunatic man is
taken as incarnation of God. This is going on. This homosex propaganda
is another side of impotency. So that is natural. If you enjoy too
much, then you become impotent.
Brahmananda: They are trying to make that more and more accepted in
America, homosex.
Prabhupada: Yes. The churches accept. It is already law.
Nitai: This women’s liberation movement, the leaders are also
homosexual. They’re lesbians.
Prabhupada: (laughs) Just see. Hare Krsna. The whole world is on the
verge of ruination. Kali-yuga. [break]
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Morning Walk — September 6, 1975, Vrndavana
So here Srila Prabhupada is explaining that too much sexual indulgence leads to homosexuality. Naturally that would include pornography, a prominent facilitator of sex indulgence, and it’s not difficult to understand a material chain of progression. A man looks at naked women, then wants something more and moves on to pictures of women having sex. So then he’s sexually aroused and seeing seeing aroused men engaged with women and gradually begins to wonder about sexual activities with men. So he becomes “bi-curious,” and heads down that road.
As Krishna describes in Bg. 2.62, “While contemplating the objects of senses, a person develops attachment for them, and from such attachment lust develops…” So there is the mechanism. I can’t believe you are unable to understand it unless you don’t want to understand due to some sort of anartha. Maybe you have some gay tendencies or a cherished porn collection, or both. It wouldn’t be surprising, but I’d rather not think about it.
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eric Reply:
August 31st, 2009 at 12:31 pm
Pandu, I was questioning Srila Parbhupada. Questioning (unless you’re in some wacky brainwashing cult) is a good thing. I came to my conclusions where I agree with him on many things and disagree with him on a few (of the material things).
For example, I disagree that too much sex leads to impotency. It’s just not a fact. I also don’t agree that homosexuality leads to impotency (or is impotency). The two things are not related.
It’s very sad to see someone saying that questioning Srila Prabhupada is “openly attacking” him. That’s extremely culty and simply wrong. Everything is not black or white and you should know that. I questioned a few things that he said and grew spiritually (and closer to him) in the process.
If you need or want a very legalistic religion, then fine, you can have that, that is there within Krishna consciousness. Personally, I don’t find any actual joy or advancement in it for myself (and that’s there within Krishna consciousness as well). That’s just me. Others may have different opinions or results. I’m fine with that too.
I guess it just comes down to this: I agree with Srila Prabhupada on many things, on most things. But I disagree with him on a few. How is that “attacking” him? I explain it more here. Maybe you’ve read it, maybe not, but it sums up my feelings.
My suggestion to you, since you’ve said that you don’t agree with the Illuminati stuff is take from articles like this and write your own, full of things you *do* believe in. That’s what we call realizations. I may not agree, but at least what you post would be honest.
I used to try to prove my point with a bunch of Prabhupada quotes, but that’s not realization either. Anybody can copy and paste. It’s when you use those quotes (and articles, experiences, etc etc) that realizations come about. And again, I may not agree with you, but I also wouldn’t be attacking you for silly Illuminati stuff. So… win/win!
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Pandu das Reply:
September 2nd, 2009 at 9:16 pm
Eric,
I’ve read a few comments here, but I’m really not interested in your friend’s opinions, or yours either. I am interested in Srila Prabhupada’s opinion, because I know he knows Krishna and can give Krishna consciousness to anyone who surrenders to him. I know this because he already gave me Krishna’s association; and Krishna in turn, while personally teaching me the process of becoming His devotee, certified Srila Prabhupada as His pure representative and then put me back to the beginning saying to follow Srila Prabhupada. This Krishna consciousness that Srila Prabhupada has to offer is so valuable that if Srila Prabhupada is somehow wrong about something, I want to be wrong in the same way. I may appear a fool by the material point of view, but wherever Srila Prabhupada is, I want to go there to be with him. Rather than surrender to this pure devotee, you think you know better. Good luck with that.
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eric Reply:
September 2nd, 2009 at 11:00 pm
Wait a minute.. so you tried to engage me in conversation and when I reciprocated, you said you don’t want to hear it.
Nice.
It’s a shame that you’re trying to turn Srila Prabhupada into what many Christians have turned Christ into: “The Only Way.”
Prabhupada taught the opposite, but since you are receiving personal instruction from Krishna Himself, maybe all that stuff has changed.
Good luck with your wacky conspiracy theories and articles about Hugh Heffner’s penis.
I’m very glad you’re of a tiny minority.
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Pandu Reply:
September 3rd, 2009 at 6:40 am
Eric,
You posted a blog entry personally ridiculing me in my attempt to help guys give up porn. You think you’re not offensive? And you know better than Prabhupada. Seems like the Hare Krishna process is a joke to you.
By the way, Srila Prabhupada is much more than Jesus to me. Christ offered salvation, but Srila Prabhupada taught pure devotional service. You should try it some time.
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eric Reply:
September 3rd, 2009 at 7:21 am
And you posted a blog article so insane that it deserved every ounce of ridicule it got (not just from me).
You are arrogant and crazy. Seek help.
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Pandu Reply:
September 3rd, 2009 at 9:09 am
Say what you want, but for me it keeps returning to the same thing… The article was supported by Srila Prabhupada’s teachings and is meant help people overcome a difficult obstacle to purity. I noticed you avoided my question about the influences of porn and homosexuality in your own life, so maybe this is too personal an issue for you to see objectively.
Srila Prabhupada spread the Hare Krishna movement all over the world and installed Krishna’s name in my heart, but you say he’s wrong and I’m crazy for putting my faith in him. You think I should listen to you instead, but I’m too arrogant. Atmavan manyate jagat.
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eric Reply:
September 3rd, 2009 at 3:33 pm
Could you point out to me where Srila Prabupada said that “all porn is gay porn” and that “illuminati bankers” are plotting to destroy marriage via the porn industry, specially playboy. There are many decent essays and articles against porn. The one you posted is really not one of them.
I didn’t even see your question about the influences of porn and homosexuality in my life. But to answer, I’ve got a lot of gay friends. Also, my son is gay. They’re all nice folks (I wouldn’t be friends with them if they weren’t). How could I possibly have anything against them? But I don’t really see them as a sexual influence in my life. I still dig the chicks, so to speak.
And as for porn, the most pornographic thing I’ve come across in a long, long while was the article you posted and its description of Heffner’s sex life.
Could you point out where I called Srila Prabhupada wrong? Could you also point out where I said that you were crazy for following Srila Prabhupada?
I may not agree with some of the things that he said. But these are material things. The spiritual topics I’m in complete agreement with. For example, I don’t agree that women have brains that weigh half that of a male’s. It’s simply not true. But that’s a material thing. Do you see the difference?
I never said that you should listen to me over Srila Prabhupada, why are you making things up? Either argue your point in a rational, truthful way or just leave it alone.
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lary Reply:
December 10th, 2010 at 1:15 pm
Pandu:
if you have my email?
please email me.
thank you,
best wishes,
l
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Bypasser Reply:
February 6th, 2011 at 4:53 am
Dear Eric,
Pamho. AGtSP.
Regarding your last comment from August 31, 2009, may I offer my humble insight.
Firstly, when Srila Prabhupada speaks about homosexuality, he tries to demonstrate how pointless it is, the way he sees it. He puts homosexuality in contradiction to “sexual activity meant for procreating Krsna-conscious children”. In other words, since homosexual relationship cannot bear children, and since the only reason for sexual activity – at least, for a Vaishnava – is to procreate Krsna-conscious children, that leaves homosexuality with only one reason for its existence – “only sense gratification”. So Srila Prabhupada puts “progeny” on one hand, and “homosex”, “impotency”, and “sense gratification” on the other hand.
Secondly, Srila Prabhupada knew a secret that is almost forgotten in our days: that there is a balance – absolute balance – in nature. So, if you suffer, you will enjoy, and if you enjoy, you will suffer. If you feel extreme heat or extreme cold, you will experience the opposite just as harshly. The Gita says: “For one who has conquered the mind, the Supersoul is already reached, for he has attained tranquility. To such a man happiness and distress, heat and cold, honor and dishonor are all the same.” (BG 6,7), and it delivers the same message in many other places. The mind is controlled by the gunas, and this is true for the one who has conquered the mind; however most of us are still struggling, so we must remember that there is a very subtle balance in nature. And from this axiom Prabhupada teaches moderation.
Thirdly, it’s nice that you can learn from so many teachers, but when you accept ONE teacher as your spiritual master, you’re not supposed to “Disagree” with him. You may not UNDERSTAND him, but this should lead you to further inquire, not to disagree, in any case.
If you have any doubts, don’t get innitiated. Innitiation is an obligation for both guru and bhakta – the pupil must follow the example of the master perfectly, and the acharya is obliged to help his disciple to tear the veil of ignorance and reach the desired spiritual goal.
Hare Krsna!
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Ryan Beggar Reply:
September 1st, 2009 at 2:36 pm
What is revealing to me us that when I read what Eric writes, I want to study spiritual matters and Krsna consciousness more. When I read scary and wrong conservative propaganda like “illuminati gay bankers” I want to avoid whatever you do. If this article was the only thing about Krsna I had ever seen, I would never want to hear His name again. Maybe thts what was sought? If so, sad and alarming…
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Bill Reply:
December 23rd, 2010 at 3:19 pm
Bravo Ryan; many people feel exactly this way. The idea that the Vedas are literally true leads to all kinds of absurdities, and when coupled with the wild statements of Prabhupada, lead many to avoid Krishna. Very much regrettable.
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08/31/2009 at 3:05 pm
How about lesbians? Is that caused by their impotency? The fact is that homosexuals almost always say that they knew they were gay before they hit puberty, before they even had sex. Plus, impotency means without the ability to have an erection, are we to believe that men become gay because they can’t have an erection because they had to much sex with women?
I’m curious Pandu, do you believe all of that? From the rational objective view it is obviously wrong, will you now claim yourself to be “attacking Prabhupada” if you really don’t believe the above to be correct?
What type of person are you to use stuff you don’t believe is true in order to brand eric as an apostate? Pretty low and slimy if you ask me. But hey, you have good company with corey/caitanya das, you can both skip down the road of your self-deluded narcissistic offensiveness while believing you’re both superior to everyone. It gives us all a glimpse into what we should all avoid in ourselves, in that way I thank you for your service.
You guys remind me of Narahari Das ( http://harekrishnanews.wordpress.com/2009/08/18/noah-where-to-hide/ ) who believes in a Jewish conspiracy to rule the world, and to take over ISKCON through “the Jew controlled GBC.” Like the author of your article he believes the Illuminati (whose leaders are Jews btw) are trying to force values such as liberalism, feminism, homosexuality, etc on the world and in ISKCON in some diabolical satanic plot. Amazingly many devotees believe such stuff.
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eric Reply:
September 1st, 2009 at 10:14 pm
I love the “Jews are going to take over ISKCON” plots. The Illuminati stuff is basically the same. Where do devotees come up with these things?
It would be nice to have Pandu’s take on these questions though.
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08/31/2009 at 4:43 pm
Indulging in sex life or whatever does not lead to impotency. In the case of Hugh Hefner, his age and general health probably have more to do with his inability to sustain an erection than any sexual proclivity he had in his past. A lifelong celibate monk with diabetes, high blood pressure and/or hardening of the arteries, stress, lowered testosterone rate — a whole slew of things, might not be able to get it up either.
Why am I posting this? I don’t know. This has been like the joke without a punchline.
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08/31/2009 at 10:35 pm
Hilarity ensues
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09/03/2009 at 6:00 am
Pandu, it is pointless to argue with these rascals, because they have already decided their position, which is against the pure devotee Srila Prabhupada’s position. This is why I don’t allow comments on my blog, because otherwise I would have to be fighting these demons all day long, and frankly, I get sick of arguing with them. Arguing with atheists is a waste of time and is like banging your head against a concrete wall.
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09/03/2009 at 6:26 am
It has been my experience that in dealing with demoniac people, it is impossible to get them to accept what you are saying, because their hearts are so hardened and full of demoniac desires. I’d even go so far as to say that the vast majority of Americans are outright demons. They are so blind and ignorant, so utterly brainwashed by the media and government, that it is impossible to break through to them. They are determined to run off the edge of the cliff, and there is nothing we can do to stop them or save them. America’s self destruction is assured.
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eric Reply:
September 3rd, 2009 at 7:28 am
You don’t allow comments, but you have no problem fighting it out on other peoples’ blogs. You are a mixed up and cowardly kid.
Corey, I’m very sorry you feel this way – that most people are demons and I am a rascal atheist. It really must suck to have to believe in such things in order to make it through your weird little day. But – whatever tugs at your bobber, I guess. If going on wild, basically fascist rants on other devotees’ (I mean, atheists’) blogs is what keeps your blood pumping, keep up the good work.
If we don’t agree with Corey, we are atheists. Cute.
You’re pretty messed up, man.
I used to defend both you and Pandu to the many, many devotees (hmm… or atheist demon rascals) who leveled their words against you. What a complete fool I was.
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09/03/2009 at 11:39 am
Eric,
I don’t understand why you people even bother replying to Corey’s comments. Come on people, he is just a kid who is trying to blow his own trumpet using resources such as Prabhupada’s writings, anti-ISKCON statements etc.
Remember, he clicked every blog linked to planetiskcon and left a comment “why he left iskcon” to justify his own decision. This also includes Sitapati’s 5 year old son’s baby blog!!! Isn’t that hilarious!
Corey is growing-up, he needs another solid 5 to 10 years to reach a state of proper thinking. Well he may not grow-up at all, but let’s hope for the best.
Hare Krishna.
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eric Reply:
September 3rd, 2009 at 10:36 pm
You’re right. It is a pointless endeavor. He is an attention whore. He actually searches the web looking for people talking about him (that’s how he came to my blog the last time he showed up – FireStats shows these things).
But he’s not just some kid blowing his trumpet. He used to be, but he’s morphed into something a bit more disturbed (and disturbed?) than that.
I do remember the “why I’m leaving iskcon” thing. He posted it several times to my blog (though it never got through).
I honestly don’t have high hopes for our boy. He will eventually either leave spiritual life all together or will become yet another insane raving ritvik (if he hasn’t already). I used to think that there was some good inside of him. But more and more I’m doubting that.
That’s a real shame.
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11/06/2009 at 2:05 am
I’ve personally known the kid for many years, even lived with him once. I can most certainly assure he is completely out of touch with reality and suffers from likely several mental conditions, exhibiting schizotypal delusions and symptoms indicative of, in my estimation, asperger syndrome.
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